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Post by Maunolith on Mar 9, 2020 11:16:54 GMT
Hello everyone, I think we should consider resetting for 1.16. My reasoning is that: - The world size is already very large, > 100 GB and growing if I remember correctly. if we ever release a map download, imagine having to download that large of a file.
- The lag is getting unbearable (yes staff are doing their best to keep entity numbers down, and keep other forms of lag under control but at a certain point it feels like we're just chasing our tails)
- The map is already 4 years old.
- The world border can't be extended anymore meaning that new features in the overworld have to be glued in (i.e. biomes regenerated, bee plugins, etc)
Eventually we might have no choice but to reset, so I'm saying let's decide now while we still have that choice to either have one, or put it off again. The day might come where we have absolutely no choice to reset - and then, it'll hurt the most. Yes, everyone would lose something if we reset but at least the server would be playable. We could enjoy the new features, a fresh experience, and actually have a decent tps to play on. Obviously, if a reset could be avoided I wouldn't be suggesting one. but, i think that it's already getting more and more difficult to put it off any longer. and if we're going to reset we should reset sooner than later because: the longer we put it off, the more players will have to lose from a reset. I left a poll on the thread to see how you guys feel, and I encourage you all to give your opinions down below. Please know, this is only a suggestion thread and isn't anything official, nor will it be deciding anything so keep that in mind while replying. Be civil, reasonable, and respectful of everyone's opinions when replying. I can see where this comes from. If there are new features then the need a plugin for them in the overworld, nether and the end. I have still nightmares from the bee plugin that adds bees to unloaded chunks causing horrible lag. Let me say that I do not want to play like that again. So a reset could help to not glue those things in the world. As a builder it will be sad that I never will finish my island before the 1.16 update thats for sure. But I like the idea for a reset. Just because that there will be more pillager outposts to explore. So that being said and from that perspective I could say yes but currently I do not see it happen anytime soon to be honest. |
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Post by Choo_Imperium on Mar 9, 2020 11:33:56 GMT
They removed the bee plug in cause it caused massive lag.
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Post by Maunolith on Mar 9, 2020 18:28:04 GMT
They removed the bee plug in cause it caused massive lag. Yes after that the lag was 10 times better. But the main concern here is that it could happen again if they "glue" stuff into the world. But it is not the answer to fix the current lag. |
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Post by cyrowind on Mar 9, 2020 23:49:26 GMT
I've read everyone's opinion above, and can't respond to all of them, so I'll just add my two cents. I've been pushing for a reset since 1.14 for my own reasons, and I have to agree with the people who said a reset now will prevent a mandatory reset later. Minecraft is a game that comes out with big updates periodically, and as such, it feels like a reset should wait because there'll be another one soon. Unfortunately, this logic leads to a buildup of players who want to play in a new world but are restricted to the limited biomes updated manually. Eventually, the server has to reset, and while this update might not be the best one, it wouldn't hurt anymore than the next one. On the lag issue, I think we should wait and see, and give the staff time to look into it. Resetting because of lag shouldn't be the only reason unless the lag is unavoidable. Like some people were saying, it's a work in progress. Reset aside, one thing I'm looking forward to is a possible hardcore based server. Maybe people who are bored might accept this as an alternative, because it adds different challenges and appeals to those who really love the game and community. I know that I haven't played a lot recently, but with 3 weeks of real time on the server, I was hoping to share my opinion based on my experiences.
Everyone: cool story bro.
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Post by WizardOfBros on Mar 10, 2020 10:32:57 GMT
I gues there are multipile ways to vote for yes or no.
My road will take me to yes:
- A fresh new start without a huge amount of lag i gues (Yes other server works also)
- With a world download all your old builds will be safed.
- Easier to start for newer players imo
- Less drama because of claimed area's/shops etc because everyone starts from zero again
- New update can be easier done i gues without removal of nether shops (I don't know if this is sure but just guesing)
- Less farms that eating server capacity
Reasons to say no:
- Work we put in (Yes also i) is gone
- Complete shop district reset (RIP)
- History is "gone" but not really because you can write it down. Also new history can be written.
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Post by Zanril on Mar 11, 2020 17:28:42 GMT
I'd like to recall a video I watched on youtube somewhere. There was this teen that built this house on a survival
server when he was a preteen. He was gone so long that the grief protection on it was lost due to him being
inactive on the server which lead to the eventual grief of his house. He shows an old screenshot of it in a isometric
view. It was a house with bricks walls, a cobbelstone roof, and oak floors. His house on the server now
looked like it was burnt down and tnt'd to death. Only a few floating blocks remained.
Explosions had made craters around where his house used to be. Over a few videos he took the opportunity to
build a new house with the stuff he learned playing with his friends on realms. He could have rebuilt what he
built on the server years ago but chose not to.
This reset discussion reminds me of that video and what I learned from it, despite being some low sub, low viewed
video I found on youtube somewhere while looking up griefing vids. (I know we have logblock to rollback stuff but)
I believe you would likely build something new in the place of something that was griefed beyond repair like this
random youtuber guy did, destruction is beautiful in that way.
Would the players of simplex be willing to vote yes for a reset so that they can take what they learned from
past experiences to play on the server using new building techniques, organization methods, updated farm designs.
Simplex is a server that stays up to date with the most recent version of the game. With so many changes and
additions over the years we are bound to reset eventually.
Like an artist that has nothing else to add to a painting, an explorer with no fog of war left to reveal, a miner
in a cave with no ores left to mine, its time to move on. Are we at the point yet?
As I learned from running the shopping district for so long, moving further away from the district Jonawebb
created as time went by and realizing I couldn't keep everything the same forever - There is no future living in the past.
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Post by Zephy on Mar 14, 2020 20:27:22 GMT
Resetting the world provides a fresh new experience for old and new players, it gives the opportunity for active members of the community to come together and to make the server truly theirs. We play in a world already molded by people that have come and gone, leaving players of all kinds stuck in a world they had no help contributing to. A reset would give many of those tired of the status quo a chance to rebuild the world of Simplex alongside a living and thriving community.
Also lag sucks
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Post by kuperion on Mar 14, 2020 21:03:27 GMT
i hate to read about threatening server resets...i've spent soo many years on this server...building, expanding, exploring and i have enjoyed it every single moment...i might not be so talkative in the chat, i enjoy building and exploring and i don't mind finding abandoned buildings, it adds a new feature to minecraft that was only achievable through mods...you're not only exploring the different biomes you find structures of active and long gone players...
i'm sad that we have to go through this everytime a new update comes up...
would it be possible to download the world? or part of it?
i don't want to lose everything that is dear to my heart...
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Post by Maunolith on Mar 14, 2020 22:43:49 GMT
i hate to read about threatening server resets...i've spent soo many years on this server...building, expanding, exploring and i have enjoyed it every single moment...i might not be so talkative in the chat, i enjoy building and exploring and i don't mind finding abandoned buildings, it adds a new feature to minecraft that was only achievable through mods...you're not only exploring the different biomes you find structures of active and long gone players... i'm sad that we have to go through this everytime a new update comes up... would it be possible to download the world? or part of it? i don't want to lose everything that is dear to my heart... I can feel your pain in this post. I hate it to when I put a lot of time into a project. But yours is on a whole diffrent universe. You build for years on it and became something that is part of you. But this makes me realise that an overworld reset is not needed because it is the nether update. So nothing new in the overworld to be found. So I am gonna vote for no now because I do not think as some people think it solves the lag. But if the moment ever comes then I agree about an world download so I can explore the world of simplex and all the builds that are there. Thank you kuperion for this post! |
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Post by dimensionalduck on Mar 15, 2020 8:05:10 GMT
i hate to read about threatening server resets...i've spent soo many years on this server...building, expanding, exploring and i have enjoyed it every single moment...i might not be so talkative in the chat, i enjoy building and exploring and i don't mind finding abandoned buildings, it adds a new feature to minecraft that was only achievable through mods...you're not only exploring the different biomes you find structures of active and long gone players... i'm sad that we have to go through this everytime a new update comes up... would it be possible to download the world? or part of it? i don't want to lose everything that is dear to my heart... Yeah, exactly that. A reset is the nuclear button, and I dont think we're at nuclear threshold. There's lag, sure, but staff are working on fixing it, and lag is really the only genuinly valid argument I'm seeing here. Again "I found a chipped brick so I'll burn the house down". There's no argument to be made about how new players dont have an even playing field. I've only been around 3 months and I think I've made good progress. Theres no argument to be made about things getting boring, you can leave your base and start over at any time. Fundamentally, this is an argument about lag and speculation of whether they can reliably implement new features. The latter of which is above standard players to speculate on. The former of which we all know is being worked on. I really see no point whatsoever in a reset other than "it'd be fun.", and if you want that either start over on your own without nuking everyone in the process, or try a different server. The only unselfish reasons for a reset boil down to "I dont trust staff to fix and solve problems, so let's nuke it.", and after 4 years of keeping this running I'm not jumping to conclusions. It's a no from me, period. |
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Post by cptchlorox on Mar 15, 2020 12:13:37 GMT
i hate to read about threatening server resets...i've spent soo many years on this server...building, expanding, exploring and i have enjoyed it every single moment...i might not be so talkative in the chat, i enjoy building and exploring and i don't mind finding abandoned buildings, it adds a new feature to minecraft that was only achievable through mods...you're not only exploring the different biomes you find structures of active and long gone players... i'm sad that we have to go through this everytime a new update comes up... would it be possible to download the world? or part of it? i don't want to lose everything that is dear to my heart... Yeah, exactly that. A reset is the nuclear button, and I dont think we're at nuclear threshold. There's lag, sure, but staff are working on fixing it, and lag is really the only genuinly valid argument I'm seeing here. Again "I found a chipped brick so I'll burn the house down". There's no argument to be made about how new players dont have an even playing field. I've only been around 3 months and I think I've made good progress. Theres no argument to be made about things getting boring, you can leave your base and start over at any time. Fundamentally, this is an argument about lag and speculation of whether they can reliably implement new features. The latter of which is above standard players to speculate on. The former of which we all know is being worked on. I really see no point whatsoever in a reset other than "it'd be fun.", and if you want that either start over on your own without nuking everyone in the process, or try a different server. The only unselfish reasons for a reset boil down to "I dont trust staff to fix and solve problems, so let's nuke it.", and after 4 years of keeping this running I'm not jumping to conclusions. It's a no from me, period. I understand that talk about server resets can be scary, and I used to panic when I saw talk too. I started this thread generally to see where everyone stood, and to make my case. I don't think anyone's making the argument "reset because i'm bored of the server", because that's not even a valid argument. I've been a part of this server for 3.25 years, and have constantly found stuff to do and have no shortage of new things to do. I've put in 110 days of playtime, and could easily put in another 100 without getting "bored enough to find a new server". I play for the community, and so new map or old map, my motives for playing won't change. Although some players get bored, it's not just the "get rich players" or the "material gatherers". One of the things I also like about the map is that you can explore and find old abandoned bases, but abandoned bases means that a BUILDER not a resource gatherer played the server, and left the server/abandoned it. Which would mean that builders get bored and leave too. Everyone can get bored sometimes, but still, boredom isn't a valid cause for a reset and maybe that's part of the reason we haven't reset thus far. We haven't had a valid reason. Do we have one now? well, that's what this thread is to decide I guess. I wasn't suggesting a reset because I wanted a fresh start, there's plenty of other servers to get a fresh start on. I was suggesting a reset because here's where we stand: someone who joins the server sees that the server is 1.15.2, but they spawn at /spawn in 1.9 chunks. New players usually don't know how this works. Heck, even when I first joined I learned the map was created in 1.9 and I wanted to know if it had 1.11's woodland mansions. it was confusing to me that the map was multiple versions. Currently, anyone who wants to find the new features have to carbon date the map and try and get around the glued together world. The last few updates added features and we couldn't have a border expansion to accommodate them. 1.16 might not be the version to reset for new features, but literally any new features they add we have to try and squeeze in to our already crowded map in order to please players, so a reset is getting harder to push off. Players who get an elytra and fireworks can explore the server just fine and get around, but it's nearly impossible for new players who haven't yet gotten to that level to explore the map and find the new features they joined for. Again, now might not be the time to reset. But it's unreasonable to say "never reset" because eventually, with our without choice we will have to reset or the server will go down. Nobody expects the server to be up for 100 years. and most people don't even expect it to be up for 10. It's already been around for nearly 4 years, and the world size is already over 200GB. Everyone's complaining about lag, and the server already can only handle about half of the players it used to. The current approach to lag is a manual way, and isn't viable long term. if there's a viable way to reduce the lag, and we can reliably provide new and old players the new features with each update, then absolutely keep the same map. I'm only for a reset if it's necessary (and would be completely against one of it wasn't necessary, or if it was just because of boredom). If we could keep the same map for 10-20 years, providing new features, and staying on top of lag, then hell yeah I'd be down. However, if it gets to the point where we can no longer expand the map and add new features, and we can no longer download the worldfile because it can't fit on the average hard drive, and the lag gets unbearable with no fix: what's the point in holding out just to protect old builds from players who don't even play anymore? With a server of this size, a reset could bring us together and we'd rebuild and within months we'd have active bases for players to explore and discover. I guess my TLDR is : we should only reset if we have to, but we shouldn't hold off on a reset just because of the past. It's a server for playing, and so priority 1 should making sure it's playable. |
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Post by WizardOfBros on Mar 15, 2020 12:21:15 GMT
I agree on Cpt, the server size is big and it's laggy. If we can reduce lag for a while and get again more players on the server instead of the 30 we have now (We had 60 a while back) then it's good for the server imo.
Also if we can have a smaller world border we can expand when it's needed again.
There should be a world download if there will be a reset.
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Post by Maunolith on Mar 15, 2020 12:49:11 GMT
I see a trend going on here. A lot of people say they want to reset because of the lag. I suggest not even to think about that. The admins working on it at the moment and learning what the cause is so they can react and solve the issue.
If we start over then at first you have no lag but after a while it comes back. Do we need to reset again? That is just of the charts for me.
Let me sum up some reasons for a reset:
- there is no space on the map anymore.
That is not even the thing that is going on here. If I random teleport you get to a lot of places where nobody has been building. So that is not the case here.
- a lot of new features have been added to the overworld.
There are some things added to the overworld like pillager outposts, woodland mansions, ocean monuments. But what adds the next update to the overworld? Nothing, it is called the nether update. So thats not a thing to get a reset going.
Those two arguements can play a big role if you want to reset or not but it is not the case here. If you get bored on simplex or get annoyed by the lag go play somewhere else untill it is fixed. With a reset you will only delay the time untill the lag comes back. So I still stick with no and it will be no.
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Post by cptchlorox on Mar 15, 2020 13:07:23 GMT
I see a trend going on here. A lot of people say they want to reset because of the lag. I suggest not even to think about that. The admins working on it at the moment and learning what the cause is so they can react and solve the issue. If we start over then at first you have no lag but after a while it comes back. Do we need to reset again? That is just of the charts for me. Let me sum up some reasons for a reset: - there is no space on the map anymore. That is not even the thing that is going on here. If I random teleport you get to a lot of places where nobody has been building. So that is not the case here. - a lot of new features have been added to the overworld. There are some things added to the overworld like pillager outposts, woodland mansions, ocean monuments. But what adds the next update to the overworld? Nothing, it is called the nether update. So thats not a thing to get a reset going. Those two arguements can play a big role if you want to reset or not but it is not the case here. If you get bored on simplex or get annoyed by the lag go play somewhere else untill it is fixed. With a reset you will only delay the time untill the lag comes back. So I still stick with no and it will be no. Fair point. Now might not be the time to reset, as 1.16 doesn’t yet have game changing features to add to the overworld. I’ll take your advice and play another server instead if the lag doesn’t get sorted out. Sure, we’ll be glueing in an entirely new nether next update, but you’re right: at least it doesn’t impact the overworld much - this version. 1.16 might not be the time to reset, but with how things are going we’ll probably have to for 1.17. |
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Post by Maunolith on Mar 15, 2020 14:40:16 GMT
I see a trend going on here. A lot of people say they want to reset because of the lag. I suggest not even to think about that. The admins working on it at the moment and learning what the cause is so they can react and solve the issue. If we start over then at first you have no lag but after a while it comes back. Do we need to reset again? That is just of the charts for me. Let me sum up some reasons for a reset: - there is no space on the map anymore. That is not even the thing that is going on here. If I random teleport you get to a lot of places where nobody has been building. So that is not the case here. - a lot of new features have been added to the overworld. There are some things added to the overworld like pillager outposts, woodland mansions, ocean monuments. But what adds the next update to the overworld? Nothing, it is called the nether update. So thats not a thing to get a reset going. Those two arguements can play a big role if you want to reset or not but it is not the case here. If you get bored on simplex or get annoyed by the lag go play somewhere else untill it is fixed. With a reset you will only delay the time untill the lag comes back. So I still stick with no and it will be no. Fair point. Now might not be the time to reset, as 1.16 doesn’t yet have game changing features to add to the overworld. I’ll take your advice and play another server instead if the lag doesn’t get sorted out. Sure, we’ll be glueing in an entirely new nether next update, but you’re right: at least it doesn’t impact the overworld much - this version. 1.16 might not be the time to reset, but with how things are going we’ll probably have to for 1.17. We need to see and wait for it what 1.17 brings. Sure the lag is not fun but there is a team of dedicated staff working on it. Only time can tell us if the lag will be gone or not. But a reset does not solve any lag. |
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